James Barclay

[Futre4]

Im sorry if this is 10 questions in one but its more of a rant (its also a small novel) .

This is a gripe of mine I have slowly developed over the years and relates not only to books but too music and movies. There is always a time in the pub now and again when someone asks the immortal question : Hey what is the best book ever written or what is the best movie ever!. Granted I cannot answer the former as I havent read enough books and I know before people begin to shout me down on the movie front also that I havent seen all movies, and also I know that it is only my opinion and for
that reason is subjective. But the answers are what vex me , as I began to answer I was almost immediately laughed at , " hmm maybe highlander or Harry Potter??" at which I quickly retorted (with which Im quite proud of) " ohh woops Im sorry its one of those conversations where you are NOT meant to say what you really think but give the standard response , ahh okay in that case ....Citizen Caine , One flew over the cuckoo's nest etc and all the other generic answers that are compiled in every list".

Be prepared for many why why why statements now :

It must be said I am not slating these choices but the point Im trying to make (somewhat laboriously granted ) is that when reading a top list of books for example I cant help wondering why its always the same?, why is it always Emma, Wuthering heights and Jane ayre in the charts?. Or Robinson crusoe ? , when was the last time someone bought Robinson Crusoe?. Why does something have to be like 100 years old before people vote for it?. Why does the top selling authors like Robert ludlum (my
fave author so maybe this a raw nerve ) who apparently are "geniuses of their genre" never get into the top 100 when they are clearly worthy, I know perhaps now I am entering now into the whole debate about whether a particular sector is recognised , in the same way comedy films never win Oscars , I just wonder sometimes who the hell votes in these so called best 100 lists ....Gullivers travels top 5 ? I ask you .

Incidentally here are the top answers to expect when talking to people who pretend

to know the genre (or at least want to look clever)
Top Movie - Citizen Caine
Best Album - Revolver Beatles ( its not ever in THEIR top 3 grr)
Best Book - Something by Jane Austen or a bronte

Lastly - Its worth mentioning I know some think I take myself too seriously but this is a light hearted rant and I do appreciate that I am just one person and my opinion is (very) subjective.

Im off to read Pride and predjudice.....


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I always knew Chang was Chinese Intelligence.

http://richardpmurfin.wordpress.com/

[Lizzy]

I have no idea who votes, but I never pay much attention to those things. Anything can get fixed when it comes to polls.

(btw Emma is one of my all time fav books and has been for years because the characters are good caricatures and I can read it again and again and still enjoy it, and I just like the story, but it's not necessarily the best book ever written)
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Listen to Lizzy, she's always right! as said by Jovial

[Mantyluoto]

i have 7 different copies of robinson crusoe. the earliest is from 1910 or so.

and 14 copies of The Swiss Family Robinson, the earliest from 1859.

just thought i'd share that useless bit of info.

[Kerela]

I remember a 'Best book'-List with Lord of the Rings in first place
2nd was the Bible , and the rest also all the Stuff by The Manns, Hesse...
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The question that sometimes drives me hazy: Am I, or the others crazy?
Albert Einstein

[Drizzt]

What annoys me is when you speak with someone who considers themself one of the 'Literati' and instantly look down their nose at fantasy or horror any anything alternative. I got into a hell of an argument with a guest lecturer at college because I had the audacity to say Frankenstein by Mary Shelley was crap and continues to be so. You'd thin k I'd insulted his mother...

Just because someone wries in a fantasy genre etc doesn't suddenly make their writing of a lesser quality or of lesser worth to literature. Harry Potter, His Dark Materials, Narnia... these combined on their own will have got more kids into reading books than anything like 'Pride & Prejudice' or 'War and Peace'.

Not that I have anything against these books, but I don't see why someone like James for example couldn't have his work included in a curriculum or have the books used for intelligent debate. I had to write about 5 essays on Frankenstein about themes some prick in a university was telling me were there because some old bloke fifyt years ago said they were and so it's now scripture that Frankenstein is a classic and a wonderful ode to loneliness. I'd rather call it a dull read made up by a girl in e tree house. Which it was. Jame's work - especially the Ascendants books - raised more and dealt with far more issues, large and small, in a far more effective and accessible way for me. But it's fantasy... issues can't be real if the setting isn't... humbug says I!!
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Pagan Music

[James]

Take a deep breath, drizzt old buddy. Then rant some more! Love it.

I think a lot of people are scared of appearing 'ill-educated' if they choose the 'wrong' book/film etc. I wish people could be more honest about such triviality as this because it is very liberating. Being scared of your own opinions is a very bad place to be.

And it depends on your definition of 'best'. Most entertaining? Most educational? Most illuminating? Most challenging? Overall feeling?

I don't suffer from it too much and I'm sure film and book snobs would smear mightily at my favourites. More fool them.
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'A human with a hand outstretched in friendship carries the fangs of a taipan in his palm.' A TaiGethen saying.

[Futre4]

Granted best is a vague statement but from my experience when asked to name the best book/film etc I name my favourite and for that reason when it isnt the 'clever option' then I get laughed down. Drizzt voices my opinions in that only a certain genre will ever get recognised as educational and important in the history of books. God forbid a book that isnt 120 years old may be seen as one of the best books ever written ( i know there are exceptions before people answer) . This whole 'its older so its better' argument is vexing to me but it is in my opinion the easy option , If I walked into ANY musical debate about any artist on the planet and interupted a heated debate on the artists albums and simply said " his/her early stuff is the best " guaranteed more than half the room would agree with me. I think there is a place for the older stuff definately , but there has to be a fine balance , and people shouldnt be scared to say their favourite book is ' Harry Potter'.

I for one would much rather have read Jurassic Park at school than some dusty old novel which I cant remember anything about (something about an old king and his sons) .
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I always knew Chang was Chinese Intelligence.

http://richardpmurfin.wordpress.com/

[TheJovialGnome]

The thing is to get people reading. it bothers me not if your 'best' books are The Famous Five by Enid Blyton just as long as you're reading! (I was always more of a Secret Seven fan myself ) So many kids these days rarely, if ever, pick up a book which is a desperate shame as there is so much good stuff out there....
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"Constant Vigilance!"

[Parmenion]

you know when ever i see one of the polls on tv etc regarding books and films i wonder who voted, they all vote for the arty bollix, the book your supposed to like.

Its one of the reasons i dont, i think LOTR is over written and a bit too fussy, but the concept is amazing.

fav film i ,love young guns as a movie its just all round good fun, i could never have a 1 best film as i dont think you can its maybe a best per genre.

same with books, these books that pick up awards, their like the art that wins awards but is a pile of garbage (literaly) they are voted by prats with no real opinions or who are trying to look more educated and with it than evryone else...screw um be yourself and dont worry about other peoples opinions...its your that counts

[Lizzy]

I think we all agree that the top 10's are a bit naff, and that it is a crying shame that more modern books are not on the national curriculum. That said my children's school library (junior school) does have a damn good selection of books from Horrid Henry to Philip Pullman, as Jov says the trick is to get them to read.

Going back to the Eng lit question, the trouble I remember having at school, is that all the over-anaylsis you have to do of the course books kind of takes the pleasure out of them anyway. Getting told what so and so is trying to say in a particular paragraph detracts from the whole thing somewhat. You forget the big picture almost. Do you know what I mean?

Of the 'classics' as they are called, well the thing is imo, alot of Shakespeare is very funny when done as a play or even a modern film (10 Things I hate about you springs to mind), and alot of Dickens and Austin has bloody excellent characters in and is good satire on life when they were written, so I hope it doesn't ever get lost.

Only time will tell what the future classics will be. Personally I hope some of my fav contemporary authors will make it but we'll see.

Oh and I only ever pick my fav things because I liked them not because it's the clever thing to say. The Great Escape will always remain one of my fav films, along with a little known film called Birdy
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Listen to Lizzy, she's always right! as said by Jovial

[Drizzt]

I know exactly what you mean - definitely a contributing factor in my now hating Frankenstein and the other books we had on the syllabus. Goign through it page by page and sometimes line by line to find a tiny little quote to back up an argument or an idea about the book/narrative/theme/character etc... did my head in, but even moreso because it was books I would never choose to read in my spare time anyway. Don't get me wrong, I realise the skill involved in picking up a piece of literature and being able to mentally tear it apart to get to the bones underneath, but it's just the way certain ideas and taken for granted as being almost scripture.

I like reading books without any hint of ideas or themes having been thrown at me beforehand so I can pick up on them myself. And then through discussion after there may be other things which others picked up and I missed which I'll agree or disagree with and so the debates begin and that's where the fun is sometimes. It's when you're told to start reading a book "with a view to..." whatever theme the examiners picked out of a hat that day.

And then there's always, without fail, the cheap and easy question ALL examiners love to ask and that's how is book x relevant in today's society. Or some variation of it. Humbug!!
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Pagan Music

[Kerela]

[Grace]

I'm doing A level English Literature at the moment, and have taken to reading the set text as fast as possible, then ignoring the teacher (who teaches her own views like gospel ) and writing poems/ reading my own book under the desks while they do the "themes" and "underlying meanings" rubbish. I shall probably get appaling grades, but it's so stupid! The GCSE and A level syllabus these days is designed to see who can parrot back what they were told the best and who can format their essays the way the examiner likes them.

All lists of "great books" are probably fixed anyway. I personally couldn't stand Dickens or Pride and Prejudice.
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Taking off is optional, landing is mandatory.

[Drizzt]

Does anyone here actually approve of the teaching format??
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Pagan Music

[Grace]

NO
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Taking off is optional, landing is mandatory.